A tape question

Started by Hlektron, October 03, 2007, 00:24:22

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Hlektron

Hello.
Does anyone know what kind those officially released tapes we bought in the past were? Ferric, chrome or metal? I was wondering.
Thanks.
No-one will ever take your place,
So in love with you...

japanesebaby

(i suppose you mean audio tapes right?)
i guess it depends on the era we're talking about(?). but it's an interesting question.
not sure what they used on commercially sold cassettes but at least for home use, but for a long time in the 80s the chrome/metal tapes used to cost so much more that they weren't really a choice for everyone, until later on. not sure what the relationship of that is to the commercially sold cassettes, if any. but i bet early/mid 80s commercial cassettes weren't really top quality tapes...

by the way, here's a nice little nostalgic site:

http://www.tapedeck.org/

:-D
Ay, in the very temple of Delight
Veil'd Melancholy has her sovran shrine

Hlektron

Thanks for your kind reply. Yes, I mean audio tapes. I'm referring to the "Concert + Curiosity" and "Standing on the Beach + B-Sides" tapes, which I'm planning to transfer on CD. Yes, I know there are remastered version already here and there, but I don't like the way they were remastered.
The thing is that my WM-DC6 has a switch that has to be set accordingly (Normal, Chrome, Metal) and I don't know what to select. To be honest, the tapes look like ferric ones, at least according to their holes on their tops. Chrome tapes have tho more holes adjacent to the ones that prevent recording and metal tapes have another couple of holes, near the midline. I hope I'm making sense, I don't have a good command of English.
No-one will ever take your place,
So in love with you...

Steve

What colour is the actual tape?
If it's black, then it's a chrome dioxide & you should set the posuition to chrome.
If it's brown (like mcDonald's coffee) then it's a ferro tape & you set the thing to normal.
Metal tapes are (funnily enough) metal coloured & you should set your switch to metal.
IIRC the concert tape was chrome. Dunno about the standing on the beach tape though.
Cheers
Steve
I know tomorrow's going to taste like cake
http://www.balatonfured.hu/en_index.php

Steve

Quote from: japanesebaby on October 03, 2007, 10:54:29


by the way, here's a nice little nostalgic site:

http://www.tapedeck.org/

:-D


Wow :shock:

I recorded the Cure in Brighton 1985 on a couple of these :-D
Cheers
Steve
I know tomorrow's going to taste like cake
http://www.balatonfured.hu/en_index.php

japanesebaby

Quote from: Hlektron on October 03, 2007, 14:08:29
The thing is that my WM-DC6 has a switch that has to be set accordingly (Normal, Chrome, Metal) and I don't know what to select. To be honest, the tapes look like ferric ones, at least according to their holes on their tops. Chrome tapes have tho more holes adjacent to the ones that prevent recording and metal tapes have another couple of holes, near the midline. I hope I'm making sense, I don't have a good command of English.

yes i see what you mean, you mean this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compact_Cassette#Cassette_types
there are differences between different cassette types in how those little holes and notches are arranged there.

i wouldn't be surprised if all those older tapes really were just ferric tapes. i didn't find anything to prove my claim just yet, but i do think chrome tapes only came later - or at least started to become popular enough to be commonly used.
maybe some later re-released (i wonder what word is one supposed to use instead of "re-pressing"? it's not exactly "pressing" when it's a cassette tape no? anyway.) tape copies might have had chrome/metal tape, but i doubt that the originals did. i guess it might depend on what "pressing" you have there? not sure though!

Quote from: Hlektron on October 03, 2007, 14:08:29
Yes, I know there are remastered version already here and there, but I don't like the way they were remastered.

by the way, if you havent' seen this, you might find some interetsing conversation about the deluxe remasters vs. "old versions" here:

http://www.curefans.com/index.php/topic,3431.0.html

the conversation was mostly on "old" cd verisons/vinyl vs. remasters, but maybe would be good to add something about the cassette tapes there too? please have a look at the topic!
Ay, in the very temple of Delight
Veil'd Melancholy has her sovran shrine

japanesebaby

Quote from: Steve on October 03, 2007, 14:37:12
Quote from: japanesebaby on October 03, 2007, 10:54:29


by the way, here's a nice little nostalgic site:

http://www.tapedeck.org/

:-D


Wow :shock:

I recorded the Cure in Brighton 1985 on a couple of these :-D

yes isn't that funny. i never saw that site until now, i thought it was so nostalgic - great that someone put all those photos up there.  :-D

i remember i used these if i was out of money:

http://www.tapedeck.org/400/tdk_d_60_klar.php

...and these whenever i could afford a bit better tapes, or had something really important to tape/copy!:

http://www.tapedeck.org/400/tdk_ad_90.php

i remember the latter ones were so expensive to buy with my poor pocket money: a two-pack cost 49 finn marks (would be approximately 8,3 euros today!) hahaha  :-D
Ay, in the very temple of Delight
Veil'd Melancholy has her sovran shrine

Hlektron

Hey, I'm glad that my post inspired some nostalgia among us. The color of the tape itself is as brown as it gets on all my tapes and the wholew on the top are very indicative of cheapo, aka normal, aka ferric tapes.
No-one will ever take your place,
So in love with you...

Steve

Then set the switch to normal.
You got me thinking now. I'll check my concert tape when I get home on Friday.
A lot of later tape decks switched automatically to the tape type IIRC, so I never really had to fiddle with switches with my Denon deck.
Cheers
Steve
I know tomorrow's going to taste like cake
http://www.balatonfured.hu/en_index.php

lostflower4

I think it's pretty much been covered now, but yes, the arrangement of hole punches on the top should help you identify it. I know that my tape deck automatically detects the bias based on this.

However, I'm not sure if a D6 deck is really the best option for archival playback. I think it was mainly designed for recording. You might get better playback from a larger standalone deck, although good ones are getting a bit hard to find these days.

dsanchez

Quote from: Hlektron on October 03, 2007, 00:24:22
Hello.
Does anyone know what kind those officially released tapes we bought in the past were? Ferric, chrome or metal? I was wondering.
Thanks.

I think most of the "original tapes" where from the Type I (normal), some others (maybe later in the 80's or beginning of 90's) where already from the Type II (chrome).

I remember it was easy to identify Normal tapes cause they had a small holes on the top-corners, Chrome tapes twice the size of those holes, and Metal, three times the size, if I'm not wrong. Also, you could see the cint of the tapes was darker in the Metal tapes and lighter in the Normal ones.
2023.11.22 Lima
2023.11.27 Montevideo

lostflower4

I've read that "official" tapes were notorious for using the cheapest crap available, so I wouldn't be surprised if many of them were "normal" position.

I'm a bit too young to have a large collection of official cassette tapes. :lol:

I think I only ever bought 4 of 5 of them!

Hlektron

QuoteHowever, I'm not sure if a D6 deck is really the best option for archival playback. I think it was mainly designed for recording. You might get better playback from a larger standalone deck, although good ones are getting a bit hard to find these days.

I own two standalone tape decks, an Aiwa AD-F550 (the successor to AD-F450 but with a digital counter) and a Teac V-610, but none sounds nearly as good as my WM-DC6, which, in fact, is considered audiophile and not only for recording. This may sound a bit exaggerative, but some have found WM-D6C to be more tuneful than a Nakamichi Dragon.
My opinion is that it has a great low end, low signal to noise ratio and very musical, sweet, "wet" highs (such as cymbals). I've done several comparative tests and they all prove that it is, at least compared to my other two decks, far superior than them.

Check out this page:
http://www.hi-fiworld.co.uk/hfw/bgcassdecks.html
No-one will ever take your place,
So in love with you...

lostflower4

Well, I can't really doubt your thoughts of the WM-D6C then. As I mentioned earlier, I'm not an expert when it comes to cassettes. I guess the opinion I stated above was based more on suspicion than fact.

I have a Teac R-H 500, which was marketed as an "audiophile" deck at the time I purchased it. I've been very happy with it, but then again I haven't done direct comparisons to anything else.

Another thing for me is that I would be a bit hesitant to buy a used deck. I mean, who knows what somebody else might have done with it? That was the reason I passed on searching for a Nakamichi Dragon or something like that, not to mention the extensive servicing/calibrating a unit like that might require.

If you were able to get a D6 deck new back in the old days, or one where you were sure of its condition, that would be pretty cool I guess.

The other important thing about transferring tapes is to use a good digital recording device. I can't believe how many people run their precious tapes into a something like a SoundBlaster Live, which does some nasty internal re-sampling of the audio and has a poor signal-to-noise ratio. :?

Hlektron

Quote
The other important thing about transferring tapes is to use a good digital recording device. I can't believe how many people run their precious tapes into a something like a SoundBlaster Live, which does some nasty internal re-sampling of the audio and has a poor signal-to-noise ratio. huh

Yes, that goes out of the question. I use a SB Fatal1ty Pro for the transfer, and 24 bit depth. Also excellent choices are ESI Julia@, EMU 1212M, EMU 1616, M-Audio 2496 Audiophile (a bit old, now), M-Audio Audiophile 192 and Terratec EWX2496. I chose to buy the Fatality for the sole reason that it had jack 3.5" inputs and outputs (among all other optical, SPDIF, RCA and MIDI inputs!)
No-one will ever take your place,
So in love with you...