Series of live concert CDs?

Started by cheyler, August 05, 2014, 03:26:36

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cheyler

Hope this works as the proper forum for this topic.
How many of us would like to see a series of live concert CDs from The Cure?  Not full tours (even if they exist) but shows from here and there throughout the decades.  Not sure how much multi-track recording they've done but it's way more expensive and a pain in the butt to boot (but sounds much better than direct to two-track mixed on the fly).  Two-track tapes, analog or digital, can be lightly equalized and put onto CD and into a paper sleeve and out the door relatively cheaply.  They could be limited to, what, 5000?  Considering the quality of what we've all got in our collections (and I'm not complaining, there's some great stuff), anything made from the original masters is going to surpass anything and everything in circulation.  This idea has been adopted by a good number of bands over the last 20+ years and I'd love to see The Cure do it.  There is still a market for bootlegs out there and there's the added incentive of, one can hope, shooting that in the head once and for all.

MeltingMan

I know the idea is good and even Robert prefer "physical" publications,me too,but
wasn't the CD meanwhile "declared dead"?
:(
En cette nation [Russie] qui n'a pas eu de théoriciens et de démagogues,
les pires ferments de destruction ont apparu. (J. Péladan)

Ulrich

Well, back in the day, I used to listen to some live recordings; there were for example some videos from festivals in 1998, which were shown on German tv and I videotaped and watched several times; also I'd taped some radio broadcasts between 1985 and 1996. (Edit: "Live in Leipzig 1990", which someone video'd for me from Swiss tv, was also very much a highlight back then!)

I was never really fond of bootlegs (due to bad experience, being ripped off for bad sounding tapes; also knowing the band won't ever see any money for these!).

I really enjoyed the official recordings which were made available (especially "Show" & "Paris", but also "Entreat", "Play Out" & "In Orange" (vhs) and "Concert"). The last ten years weren't too bad when it comes to live recordings, we got the "Trilogy" and "Festival 05" dvd's (and "Live in Paris 08" was shown on tv; plus there were various streams of gigs). On youtube, there is a seemingly neverending supply of live videos and stuff!
In short: we've never had it so good when it comes to hearing/viewing live shows.  :o

In the official statement earlier this year, Robert announced various live dvd's, none of them have appeared so far. Maybe they will, maybe not. I would of course buy some of them, but I can live happily without them if they never get released. Same thing for a "series of live cd's", I'm sorry cheyler!  :oops:

Quote from: MeltingMan on August 05, 2014, 15:35:52
but wasn't the CD meanwhile "declared death"?

"Dead"... but it isn't 100% true of course. Sales are in decline, but still enough to press cd's.

Here (German link only, sorry):
Quote
Die CD zeigt Stärke und verbucht zwei Drittel aller Musikumsätze in Deutschland.
Mit 77 Prozent der gesamten Musikumsätze behauptet der physische Tonträgermarkt seine Stärke und bleibt die wichtigste Säule des Musikvertriebs in Deutschland.
http://www.musikindustrie.de/jahrbuch-umsatz-2013/
The holy city breathed like a dying man...

cheyler

I'd like to see that Leipzig '90.  Those two years between Roger leaving and the Kilburn show in May '92 are sort of fun on their own.  The thought came from watching 'Play Out' again.  I'd like to have that whole Town & Country Club show, the version of 'The Big Hand' is my favorite.  The sound quality is better than 'Show'.  The CDs anyway, the sound on the VCDs is much better than the CDs.  Looking forward to the expanded 'Show' and 'Paris' now too (whenever that may be).  All this live stuff and still wanting more. 

Frank Zappa, the Grateful Dead, King Crimson, NRPS (and others) all have 'from the vaults' programs, with varying degrees of success.  The Grateful Dead probably being the most successful.  They put out a $500 22-gig 70+-disc boxed set, made thousands of them, and it sold out completely.  Being affiliated with Warner Bros. (once upon a time) can't hurt since they have more money than most governments.  They've had a live-from-the-vaults program in place since 1991 and have released a couple hundred concerts.  Seriously, more than two hundred, from whole tours down to individual gigs.  From 48-track digital and Blu-Ray down to a CD mastered from a 45-year-old cassette tape.  And they sell and sell and sell.  You wouldn't think a bunch of hippies would have the cash, would you?

MeltingMan

Quote from: Ulrich on August 05, 2014, 16:46:42
Well, back in the day, I used to listen to some live recordings; there were for example some videos from festivals in 1998, which were shown on German tv and I videotaped and watched several times; also I'd taped some radio broadcasts between 1985 and 1996. (Edit: "Live in Leipzig 1990", which someone video'd for me from Swiss tv, was also very much a highlight back then!)

I was never really fond of bootlegs (due to bad experience, being ripped off for bad sounding tapes; also knowing the band won't ever see any money for these!).

I really enjoyed the official recordings which were made available (especially "Show" & "Paris", but also "Entreat", "Play Out" (vhs) and "Concert"). The last ten years weren't too bad when it comes to live recordings, we got the "Trilogy" and "Festival 05" dvd's (and "Live in Paris 08" was shown on tv; plus there were various streams of gigs). On youtube, there is a seemingly neverending supply of live videos and stuff!
In short: we've never had it so good when it comes to hearing/viewing live shows.  :o

In the official statement earlier this year, Robert announced various live dvd's, none of them have appeared so far. Maybe they will, maybe not. I would of course buy some of them, but I can live happily without them if they never get released. Same thing for a "series of live cd's", I'm sorry cheyler!  :oops:

Quote from: MeltingMan on August 05, 2014, 15:35:52
but wasn't the CD meanwhile "declared death"?

"Dead"... but it isn't 100% true of course. Sales are in decline, but still enough to press cd's.

Here (German link only, sorry):
Quote
Die CD zeigt Stärke und verbucht zwei Drittel aller Musikumsätze in Deutschland.
Mit 77 Prozent der gesamten Musikumsätze behauptet der physische Tonträgermarkt seine Stärke und bleibt die wichtigste Säule des Musikvertriebs in Deutschland.
http://www.musikindustrie.de/jahrbuch-umsatz-2013/
I can share this view,Ulrich.Don't be surprised,but I removed my CD's this year with a growing
number of digital downloads on the other hand,with costs,of course,but retained my books and
DVD's.We grew up with LP's and MC's and sometimes I think the listening pleasure is gone with
the digital stuff.In fact,I needed more space and "structure".Listening pleasure,as mentioned
before is possible,I like the old 45 rpm records,but not without a new "investment". :?
En cette nation [Russie] qui n'a pas eu de théoriciens et de démagogues,
les pires ferments de destruction ont apparu. (J. Péladan)

cheyler

How do you both archive your digital stuff, DVD or HD or both?  I used to burn audio CDs, then switched to burning the flacs and shns to CD, then switched to burning several downloads to DVD then added an external HD (then a couple more) and kept burning downloads to DVD in order to keep space clear on the HDs (which I ended up filling with more DLs anyway).  I couldn't add it all up if I tried.  I justified downloading all this stuff by telling myself that there would come a time when I could relax and start listening to all of it.  I'm pretty sure that at this point I have more archived music than I have years left in my life (if I calculate a figure for each in real time).  The listening is great, there's nothing better than music, but the collecting is great fun too.

Ulrich, would you translate your link?  My German's not great.  If I had to guess, I think it was something like CDs make up 77% of music sales?  That's either correct or a pathetic guess...

Ulrich

Quote from: cheyler on August 05, 2014, 18:08:04
I'd like to see that Leipzig '90. 

Well I could not find the whole tv broadcast on youtube, at least not in one video, but if you watch this playist here you'll have lots of it (there's even a few songs which weren't on my old video tape!):
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLSv1ZbS-v5iSO3iHN2etKZ7W1Xm8ibROg

Quote from: MeltingMan on August 05, 2014, 20:08:29
We grew up with LP's and MC's and sometimes I think the listening pleasure is gone with
the digital stuff.

Yeah - I got lots of cds, but also vinyl and tapes. I also still like 7" singles (45RPM) and buy some vinyl records from time to time.
In fact, from what I gathered, "analogue" is often better sounding than "digital" (of course, the industry tried to tell us the opposite).

Quote from: cheyler on August 06, 2014, 05:06:48
How do you both archive your digital stuff, DVD or HD or both?

Not at all. I have piles of cds and dvds, some digital downloads here on a computer, but that's it.

Quote from: cheyler on August 06, 2014, 05:06:48
If I had to guess, I think it was something like CDs make up 77% of music sales?  That's either correct or a pathetic guess...

Absolutely correct. In Germany apparently "physical" sales are still up to 77% of the whole market.
The holy city breathed like a dying man...

Matti

Setting aside the question whether CDs are dead and what's the latest storage solution for media...

I remember that there even was an idea to make some Dream Tour shows available as a series of live CDs back in the day. But, The Cure being the band they are, that got dumped or forgotten.

Quote from: cheyler on August 05, 2014, 03:26:36
Considering the quality of what we've all got in our collections (and I'm not complaining, there's some great stuff), anything made from the original masters is going to surpass anything and everything in circulation.  (...) There is still a market for bootlegs out there and there's the added incentive of, one can hope, shooting that in the head once and for all.

Now this is something I can't really agree to. Over the last few years, so many bootlegs sourced from (pre) FM masters or other SBDs appeared on the market as you call it. Sure, with a proper remastering (and I'm not talking Thir13n or whatever his name was here) some could be made even better, but for instance I think that The XFM recording of the Kilburn 1992 gig still dwarfs Show. Other than that, is there really a market still for boots? I admit I haven't seen a record fair in years, but do they produce new ones? Does that stuff sell?

And before it comes to official live stuff (which I'd love to see, and yes, I'd prefer tangible CDs, with a proper cover - gimme something to touch and look at!), let's get those missing Deluxe Editions rolling.
and we close our eyes to sleep
to dream a boy and girl
who dream the world is nothing but a dream

Ulrich

Quote from: Matti on August 06, 2014, 10:19:46
Other than that, is there really a market still for boots? I admit I haven't seen a record fair in years, but do they produce new ones? Does that stuff sell?

I have no idea if/how they sell. I guess the occasional bootleg is still being done.

Here is a list, but you'd have to click on the albums to know which year they were released...
http://www.discogs.com/lists/The-Cure-Live-Bootlegs/146238

Here the latest is from 2005:
http://www.spirit-of-rock.com/discographie-groupe-The_Cure-type-Bootlegs-l-de.html
The holy city breathed like a dying man...

cheyler

Thank you Ulrich, for the translation and the link to Leipzig...

I didn't know there had been a plan to release live CDs at one time.  I just don't get the demand for bootlegs unless people just like to collect the artifact, like 7" picture sleeves.

I agree with Matti, the XFM recording of the Kilburn gig is far superior to the 'Show' recording.  How can a one-shot-deal crew make a better recording than a well-paid professional crew making a multi-track recording over two nights?  The sound on the 'Show' video is far superior to the CD too (but still not as good as Kilburn).  Gotta say I've switched back to 1992 being my favorite, with 1989 being second and 2005-08 getting (very) honorable mention.  Watched the 2-hour 'Show' again yesterday, that band was on FIRE, Porl's guitar defines (oops...defined) The Cure for me.  He was running wild on the night(s).

Ulrich

Quote from: cheyler on August 06, 2014, 18:44:13
I just don't get the demand for bootlegs unless people just like to collect the artifact, like 7" picture sleeves.

I agree with Matti, the XFM recording of the Kilburn gig is far superior to the 'Show' recording. 

Seems like a case of "you just answered your question yourself"! If that bootleg is so good sounding, why should fans not get it?
Other reasons are: collecting of course. Owning a recording of a gig you went to. Listening to those different setlists (e.g. on the Swing tour there were lots of changes in setlists) etc.
The holy city breathed like a dying man...

cheyler

It's the same with all bands, Murphy's Law as always.  The period when Jason joined (not his fault) until 2000 is my very least favorite era but there are lots of great recordings.  Skipped the 'Faith' tour, they were nearby but I was more interested in the 'TIB' material at the time, that's definitely the one that got away.  Also skipped the 'Top' tour and the 'HOTD' tour.  Had a chance to see Roger's 2nd ever show...missed it.  Saw Bob Dylan and the Grateful Dead instead.  Saw the 'Wish' tour and have a crappy bootleg of it.  Skipped 2004 and missed 2008 and will definitely not be going to any future gigs (unless Perry comes back).  The great shows are recorded poorly and the mediocre shows sound great.  Damn.

Ulrich

Quote from: cheyler on August 07, 2014, 20:54:07
It's the same with all bands

Not for me.  :P
There are of course shows I missed, but in general I'm quite happy with what I've seen so far.

With the Cure, of course, due to late birth, I came in a bit too late (I missed the '87 and '89 tours), but still am happy with the shows I did see from 1992 to 2008.  :)
For all the rest, there were/are live recordings (bootleg & official) to remind me what I missed.  :roll:

Quote from: cheyler on August 07, 2014, 20:54:07
...will definitely not be going to any future gigs (unless Perry comes back).  The great shows are recorded poorly and the mediocre shows sound great.

Poor. Very poor.
Do you realise you're standing in your own way here? You "skipped" the shows with Perry in 2004 and now you regret it. In a few years you'll regret skipping the current shows etc. etc.  :smth011
The holy city breathed like a dying man...