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Who is your favourite The Cure drummer?

Author Topic: Jason Cooper - A study of his style  (Read 47542 times)

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Offline patitodark

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Re: Jason Cooper - A study of his style
« Reply #180 on: June 03, 2016, 07:08:55 »
It's for the band members, lights, crew - anyone involved I guess.

Do you honestly think they DON'T play along to a click and pre-recorded tracks?

No, but I don't really care much. It seems very important to you and patito, as you go on and on about it, like a broken record...

The broken record spins again:

In The Hanging Garden, there is a tambourine that Jason doesn't play but is pre-recorded in the backing track.

https://youtu.be/UGtuho2Ca7Y



Offline cheyler

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Re: Jason Cooper - A study of his style
« Reply #181 on: June 03, 2016, 17:57:08 »
Doesn't look like Jason is playing much at all on Out Of This World.  Reeves is doing Perry's part pretty well, only time I don't begrudge him that whammy bar of his.  Porl on Paris 2008, really hoping that makes it out on DVD some day, the hour-long version is great, but...more more more!  The '05-'09 quartet line-up is my favorite of all Cure line-ups.  Highly maneuverable, as they say.  Never seen the 2007 video, where was it taped?  Thanks for the information and the links.
'And the........festivities?'
(Valentine Dyall in 'City Of The Dead')

'Beware of those in whom the desire to punish is strong.'
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'...my own work, I am risking my life for it and my reason has half foundered because of it...'
(Vincent VanGogh)

Offline dmscheuer

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Re: Jason Cooper - A study of his style
« Reply #182 on: June 09, 2016, 00:59:45 »


See them numbers next to the titles? Thats the tempo for the click track and pre-recorded stuff  :(

Oh well...

I'm still gonna see them in NY, however not as excited as others seem to be

Offline Ulrich

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Re: Jason Cooper - A study of his style
« Reply #183 on: June 11, 2016, 10:36:53 »
In this vid, at some points, you can see quite clearly what JC does with his hands (& feet)... Not too bad for my ears/eyes. (Maybe it's because he'd already played on the studio version.)


See them numbers next to the titles? Thats the tempo for the click track ...

Is it really? Or is it the "beats per minute", e.g. for the lighting guys to know the tempo?  :?
but memory's not life... and it's not love.

Offline dmscheuer

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Re: Jason Cooper - A study of his style
« Reply #184 on: June 11, 2016, 23:20:39 »
Is it really? Or is it the "beats per minute", e.g. for the lighting guys to know the tempo?  :?
:D

1) The video you posted is set to private, can't see it here in the US

2) Uh, the 'tempo' and 'beats per minute' are the same thing. Have a very very hard time thinking the light guys need info like "RS 12 string+flute" or "JC=hotdrods"
That last one is awful. Hotrods are absolutely terrible live.

Annnnnd also - the numbers next to the tempo (BPM) is the exact length of the song (min:sec)
Everything is micromanaged to the last second. How long each song is, how long each set is..... No improvisation. Cookie-cutter if you will.

As I've said in previous posts, I don't know who makes the decision for pre-recorded tracks to play along with. They've not had to do it not too long ago. Why now? Why all of the time? It's kinda, pun maybe intended, depressing.


EDIT: ok was able to see the Jupiter Crash video. Again with the brushes/hotrods..... can't hear much of what he's actually playing when they're used live. But watching it, that might be a blessing. More cymbal mania in the intro, where on WMS there are zero drums. Why, you might ask? Coz it's all played to a click track that JC hears in his monitor. He needs to 'tell' everyone else where they are in the pre-mapped out song to make sure the pre-recorded stuff plays back at the correct spot. So the extra guitar parts that may come in on the chorus actually come in on the chorus and not before or after. Or out of time with the band. And also why they know exactly how long each song is, and how long each set is.


Offline Ulrich

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Re: Jason Cooper - A study of his style
« Reply #185 on: June 12, 2016, 10:16:21 »
Have a very very hard time thinking the light guys need info like "RS 12 string+flute" or "JC=hotdrods"

So who is it for then? Roadies (which is what I meant with "for example light guys")?
Where did you find that list? Why not give that info when you post it?  :?

Must look up what a "hotrod" is. But not today, kinda busy with other things...

As I've said in previous posts, I don't know who makes the decision for pre-recorded tracks to play along with.

Neither do I.
but memory's not life... and it's not love.

Offline dmscheuer

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Re: Jason Cooper - A study of his style
« Reply #186 on: June 13, 2016, 23:58:00 »
Have a very very hard time thinking the light guys need info like "RS 12 string+flute" or "JC=hotdrods"

So who is it for then? Roadies (which is what I meant with "for example light guys")?
Where did you find that list? Why not give that info when you post it?  :?

Must look up what a "hotrod" is. But not today, kinda busy with other things...

As I've said in previous posts, I don't know who makes the decision for pre-recorded tracks to play along with.

Neither do I.

It's for the band members, lights, crew - anyone involved I guess.

Chain of Flowers:
https://twitter.com/CraigatCoF/status/740415737685250049

Do you honestly think they DON'T play along to a click and pre-recorded tracks? Or is this just more apologist arguments? lol

Have you looked up hotrods yet? If not here ya go Ulrich:

http://www.promark.com/pmProductDetail.Page?ActiveID=3917&productid=171&productname=H_RODS_Hot_Rods

Offline cheyler

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Re: Jason Cooper - A study of his style
« Reply #187 on: June 14, 2016, 01:36:20 »
Makes me nostalgic for the days of Boris' handwritten setlists.  A lot of this is due to the rigid lighting cues and video screens I suppose, but it takes some of the fun out of it for the fans if we know the whole set and even the encores are mapped out entirely ahead of time.  Can't be much fun for Jason either, not much of a challenge as a drummer, unless you're suggesting (as some have) that he is such a poor drummer that he requires a click track to keep time for him.  But I don't think you're suggesting that.
'And the........festivities?'
(Valentine Dyall in 'City Of The Dead')

'Beware of those in whom the desire to punish is strong.'
(F. Nietzsche)

'...my own work, I am risking my life for it and my reason has half foundered because of it...'
(Vincent VanGogh)

Offline Ulrich

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Re: Jason Cooper - A study of his style
« Reply #188 on: June 14, 2016, 11:25:33 »
It's for the band members, lights, crew - anyone involved I guess.

Do you honestly think they DON'T play along to a click and pre-recorded tracks?

No, but I don't really care much. It seems very important to you and patito, as you go on and on about it, like a broken record...

Have you looked up hotrods yet? If not here ya go ...

Thanks very much for the link!  :)
but memory's not life... and it's not love.

Offline lostflower4

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Re: Jason Cooper - A study of his style
« Reply #189 on: June 19, 2016, 10:14:57 »


See them numbers next to the titles? Thats the tempo for the click track and pre-recorded stuff  :(

Oh well...

I'm still gonna see them in NY, however not as excited as others seem to be

Yeah, those ever-unchanging fixed tempos (Robert apparently has an OCD issue in choosing even numbers of 5, which is silly to me... Yes, I know if you always practice a song at the exact same tempo it makes it easier, but Boris & co. had the freedom to change up tempos based on feel (something Jason has very little of in terms of rock-n-roll rhythms...)

I'm just going to say it, I saw Jason twice this month, and the dude is so fried in the head from his "habits" let's just say...
 HE was hitting cymbals half a beat early, have a beat late, and was just ALL OVER THE MAP in his timing. He can't even keep a steady 1-2-3-4 backbeat for more than 1I've been to lots of "big name" shows and the only equally poor drummer I've seen (both professional and small-time bands) was Mogwai's replacement drummer

Offline Ulrich

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Re: Jason Cooper - A study of his style
« Reply #190 on: June 19, 2016, 10:53:22 »
I saw Jason twice this month

With the Cure I guess? It's a pity you didn't find time to write a gig review for this forum.  :(
but memory's not life... and it's not love.


Offline lostflower4

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Re: Jason Cooper - A study of his style
« Reply #191 on: June 19, 2016, 11:54:07 »
Jason can't play in time to save his life anymore... He could keep "acceptably" decent time when he joined the band, but I always found his style to be weak, unspired, and lacking in feeling - he's simply not a "natural" what comes to being a great percussionist.

Oddly enough, I think the rest of the band is sounding better than they have since the early '90s, like they really started taking it seriously again. But Jason just continues to get coked out of his mind (just look at him if you don't believe me, he's a mess), and Robert doesn't seem to give a shit...

I will just say it, Jason is a borderline mediocre drummer (I think "mediocre" is a bit of a generous term. I meant, let's just say it:  If Jason were to leave the Cure, he would never find another group of such status, just as Perry never will due to their lack og talent relative to Robert, Simon, Roger, Reeves, and many who came before...

I have played with numerous random "amateur" drummers over the years, some still of school-age who put Jason to shame, if only on the account that they can keep a solid beat for over a minute. Jason has had something like 21 years to prove himself and people are still saying, "hey, he's getting better even though it's more likely people "getting used" to him or learning to turn him out, which I've gotten pretty good at. But this dimishes the band as a whole, unfortunately.

And his live playing is a joke these days if you let yourself see/hear it - you would think the other members would eventually get sick of playing with such a poor drummer, but I suspect in live shows they have him turned off in their monitors (just like they did with Perry, who would throw everyone else in the band off with his also erratic and/or bad playing.

Virtually every drummer in any band I can think of, ever - whether I like the music or not - has a better drummer than the Cure does now. It's like a sick joke that's been going on for some 23-24 years too long...   :smth011

What did we do, Robert?  :P

Offline lostflower4

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Re: Jason Cooper - A study of his style
« Reply #192 on: June 19, 2016, 12:26:38 »
I saw Jason twice this month

With the Cure I guess? It's a pity you didn't find time to write a gig review for this forum.  :(

Yeah, he was with the Cure that night. I know he's a highly in-demand session drummer throughout the world (hahaha!), but yes the Cure.

I have my own fond memories of the shows I saw, in which Robert, Simon, Reeves, and Roger really impressed the hell out of me by doing so well and helping keep my focus off of of the spastic crackhead drummer (yes, it's a bit twisted but I am a longtime fan and try my best to focus on the positive.

But there IS a huuuuge talent-less and strung out ELEPHANT in the room (or in the band, to be exact). Maybe someday something will improve in this regard, but the 22 year wait has been rather excruciating if I'm being honest.

Sorry, I like to see one of my favorite bands in top form, and I really just blame Jason for being so poor at what he does. If I was at his level I would be ashamed and part ways with a band that deserved better.

(Here's hoping something happens and the Cure gets at least one more (good) drummer in their career...)

Offline Ulrich

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Re: Jason Cooper - A study of his style
« Reply #193 on: June 19, 2016, 14:22:18 »
Yeah, he was with the Cure that night.

I have my own fond memories of the shows I saw, in which Robert, Simon, Reeves, and Roger really impressed the hell out of me by doing so well

Thanks. Here is the section of the forums for the live shows, reviews etc., just in case you want to report more about those 2 gigs (instead of focussing on the one aspect you did not like):
http://curefans.com/upcoming-shows/
but memory's not life... and it's not love.

Offline patitodark

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Re: Jason Cooper - A study of his style
« Reply #194 on: June 22, 2016, 07:24:22 »
In this vid, at some points, you can see quite clearly what JC does with his hands (& feet)... Not too bad for my ears/eyes. (Maybe it's because he'd already played on the studio version.)

In Jupiter Crash, Jason does play everything. He recorded this one for the studio version.
BUT by now we all know that that wonderful pattern was demoed by Boris. Jason just copied it.


Hotrods are absolutely terrible live.

Specially in The Caterpillar!!! That mess-intro is awful!

More cymbal mania in the intro, where on WMS there are zero drums. Why, you might ask? Coz it's all played to a click track that JC hears in his monitor. He needs to 'tell' everyone else where they are in the pre-mapped out song to make sure the pre-recorded stuff plays back at the correct spot. So the extra guitar parts that may come in on the chorus actually come in on the chorus and not before or after. Or out of time with the band. And also why they know exactly how long each song is, and how long each set is.

In that pre-recorded stuff that Jason is hearing, there is a cue, like a beep or something that alerts him that the song is about to finish.

...But there IS a huuuuge talent-less and strung out ELEPHANT in the room (or in the band, to be exact). Maybe someday something will improve in this regard, but the 22 year wait has been rather excruciating if I'm being honest.

A few days ago, I friend of mine went to see the band live in Montreal. He knew The Cure is my favorite band and during the show he sent me a couple of photos showing me the great light work.

A day after, I asked him what were his impressions of the show... it was his first Cure show and he liked it. He said Robert's loud and clear voice is what impressed him the most. He also asked me WHAT IS GOING ON WITH THE DRUMMER. What is wrong with him?  For my friend, Jason was like a lifeless guy with no emotion towards the music and/or his instrument...




 

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